SUMMER SPECIAL - COVID FLASHBACK

Covid-19 was five long years ago. In a series of short summer specials, CX Files is bringing you some memories of what was going on at a very chaotic time for the industry. During the early days of the pandemic, CX Files went from weekly to daily and captured many important observations on how the CX industry was coping across the world.

John Devlin is the Founder and CEO of Ascensos (acquired by Firstsource in 2024) - he is still in this position.

John talked to Mark Hillary on March 26, 2020. This was day one of the first Covid lockdown in the UK - the Prime Minister had urged everyone in the nation to stay at home on March 23rd... it was enforcable from March 26th. Companies with staff in offices had three days to figure out how to keep going and many businesses were not able to function at all.

Many of these conversations feel historic. It's worth revisiting some of them just to remember the sense of chaos in the industry at this time and how the industry adapted and coped with the challenges of 2020 and 2021.

https://www.linkedin.com/in/john-devlin-4731521/

https://www.ascensos.com/

https://www.firstsource.com/

Dave D'Arcy is the founder of Laughing Leadership. He is based in Tring, close to London in the UK.

Laughing Leadership was created to guide business leaders to build the environment to nurture and develop happy engaged employees. The solution is not in bean bags, slides, fruit on Friday or free tea and coffee. It is in culture. And culture is a byproduct of leadership style.

In this conversation with Peter Ryan, Dave talks about some of the 'groundhog day' issues he keeps reading about and seeing in CX. Why do we keep reading about the same CX issues over and over again? Why is the CX business news from years ago just about the same as today? Why do we always see the hype cycle with new technologies - such as AI?

https://www.linkedin.com/in/davemdarcy/

https://www.davedarcy.co.uk/

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/qbH1R9yDdr4

CX FILES IS TAKING A BREAK FOR THE REST OF AUGUST - WE ARE BACK ON SEPTEMBER 4! Keep tuning in as we plan to repeat some clips from this time exactly five years ago during the Covid pandemic - how did the CX industry cope? CX Files switched to almost daily interviews during the early part of the pandemic, so we will clip a few of the best interviews to share with you again this August... see you again in September!

SUMMARY:

Mark Hillary and Peter Ryan discuss the final episode of the CX Files podcast before taking a break in August. They introduce Dave D'Arcy, founder of Laughing Leadership, who focuses on leadership and employee engagement. D'Arcy critiques common CX industry issues, such as outcome-based pricing models, lack of investment in training, and the overemphasis on impact sourcing. He argues that AI has not lived up to its hype and has led to employee disengagement. D'Arcy emphasizes the need for businesses to invest in their employees and align strategies with clear business objectives.

Amanda Quinn is the Founder and Principal of Quinn Growth Advisors.

She is based in Raleigh, North Carolina, USA.

In this conversation with Peter Ryan, Amanda talks about her work advising BPOs on how to build growth and develop a sales pipeline. Amanda advises focusing on deep expertise and specialization, rather than claiming to offer every single service and excelling at none of them.

How can BPOs compete and leverage technology to improve what they offer to clients?

https://www.linkedin.com/in/amandaquinnmalach/

https://quinngrowthadvisors.com/

SUMMARY:

Mark Hillary and Peter Ryan discuss the challenges faced by BPOs (Business Process Outsourcing) in the market, emphasizing the need for specialization over generalism. They highlight the inefficiencies of BPOs claiming to offer a wide range of services without excelling in any. Amanda Quinn, founder of Quinn Growth Advisors, is introduced as a guest who advocates for BPOs to focus on niche markets and develop deep expertise. Quinn advises BPOs to identify their strengths through internal stakeholder meetings and client feedback, and to expand by adding related services or industries. She also stresses the importance of charging for value-added services and leveraging technology to enhance service delivery.

Mike Ortegon is a customer solutions director at Yoummday. He is an American based in London and he has a focus on the global travel industry - with a long track record of leadership roles in travel companies.

Mark Hillary called Mike to talk about travel. How has it recovered since the pandemic? What trends are travel companies seeing that are new for the 2020s? Are travel companies becoming more proactive in their approach to the customer experience? Why are some people around the world protesting that there is too much tourism now?

Mike talked about all these issues and explored how the customer experience is integral to ensuring that customers enjoy their travel and also want to remain loyal to the hotel/airline/travel agency they are using...

https://www.linkedin.com/in/mikeortegon/

https://www.yoummday.com/

SUMMARY

Mark Hillary and Peter Ryan discuss the evolving travel industry with Mike Ortegon, a customer solutions director at Yoummday. They explore the impact of anti-tourism protests, the rise of multi-generational travel, and the shift from reactive to proactive customer service. Ortegon highlights the importance of automation, local experiences, and inclusivity, noting that 50% of travelers now take more than one trip annually. He also emphasizes the need for travel companies to balance technology with human touch, especially for Gen Z, and to address accessibility challenges for travelers with mobility issues. The conversation underscores the industry's focus on enhancing customer experiences and adapting to changing travel behaviors.

Jon Florence is the SVP of Industry Solutions at Xima Software. He is based in South Jordan, Utah.

Xima is a contact center software company that is focused on AI solutions.

Peter Ryan called Jon to discuss AI in CX. Beyond the hype, how can companies managing their own CX and BPOs all benefit from the use of AI in the contact center? What are the genuine and practical use cases that move the dial and which claims are just hype?

What can you really do with AI today?

https://www.linkedin.com/in/jon-florence-67019a79/

https://ximasoftware.com/

SUMMARY:

Mark Hillary and Peter Ryan introduce Jon Florence, SVP of Industry Solutions at Xima Software. Jon explains his role in integrating AI into customer experience solutions. They delve into the hype cycle of AI, comparing it to the VoIP boom, and emphasize the importance of understanding business needs before implementing AI. Jon advises starting with simple AI tools like speech analytics and messaging bots, and stresses the need for certified integrations. He also highlights the importance of testing AI capabilities and ensuring long-term vendor stability to avoid future consolidation issues.

Thomas Oronti is the CEO at Advensus. He is based in Santo Domingo, Dominican Republic.

The CX Files has explored many different nearshore options in the Caribbean region, but has never explored the Dominican Republic before and yet this location has the advantage of being able to easily offer customer support in English, Spanish, and French - thanks to Haiti also sharing the island of Hispaniola.

https://maps.app.goo.gl/wgpE2LoSLp9tu6TX6

Peter Ryan talked to Thomas about the growing importance of the DR in the nearshore CX and BPO sector and how Advensus strongly focuses on the role of the agent in any CX strategy.

https://www.linkedin.com/in/thomas-oronti-67777a12/

https://advensus.com/

SUMMARY:

Mark Hillary and Peter Ryan discuss the Dominican Republic's growing importance in the BPO and CX sectors. Thomas Oronti, CEO of Advensus, highlights the DR's unique trilingual labor pool, strong English proficiency, and robust connectivity. Advensus has grown from 100 to over 5,500 seats in 19 years, offering services like translation, collections, and customer service. The DR's stability, political reliability, and cost-effectiveness make it a premier nearshore destination. Oronti emphasizes the need for better English training programs and the potential for servicing Spanish, French, and English markets. The DR's success is attributed to its flexible workforce and strategic location.

PANEL: In Face of Stagnating Favorability Ratings, What’s Next for South African Offshore CX?

When Ryan Strategic Advisory published the most favorable offshore location study last May, South Africa had dropped to third position, compared to more recently topping the poll.

This survey features feedback from over 800 CX decision-makers and is potentially the largest survey that explores where CX leaders will consider operations.

https://ryanadvisory.com/india-is-the-most-favored-offshore-cx-delivery-point-in-2025/

India and the Philippines are now the most popular destinations, but have these giant destinations just reasserted their postiion or is something going wrong in South Africa?

South Africa is still in the top three destinations, but is this slip from the top position a significant change or a blip?

Peter Ryan called together a group of three experts to talk about the change in favorability and what is next for BPO and CX in South Africa...

Lian Rowlands

Owner and Principal Consultant at Tayma Solutions

Liverpool, UK

https://www.linkedin.com/in/lian-rowlands-a26119/

Steve Weston

Founder of ApexCX

Baltimore, MD, USA

https://www.linkedin.com/in/steve-weston-1843152/

https://www.linkedin.com/company/apexcx-customer-experience-support-services/

Mark Essey

CEO Custom Connect South Africa

Durban, South Africa

https://www.linkedin.com/in/markessey/

https://www.customconnect.com/

Summary:

In the CX Files podcast episode from July 3, 2025, hosts Mark Hillary and Peter Ryan discuss the recent Ryan Strategic Advisory survey on CX technology and global services, which ranked offshore destinations for favorability. India ranked first, the Philippines second, and South Africa tied for third with Poland. The conversation features experts Lian Rowlands, Steve Weston, and Mark Essey, who discuss South Africa's decline in favorability rankings despite maintaining a strong delivery system. They highlight the need for South Africa to reinvent its value proposition, focusing on data security, compliance, and advanced technology to regain its top position. The discussion emphasizes the importance of government support, industry cooperation, and forward-thinking strategies to enhance South Africa's BPO sector.

Pete Jones is the founder and CEO of Grypp. He is based in the UK between London and Birmingham.

Grypp is a visual platform that aims to help contact centers and the agents working within them see what their customers can see.

This can be a transformative technology for many support environments and it is low cost and proven - in contrast to many of the AI projects we have covered recently on the podcast.

Mark Hillary called Pete to get an ouline of the various ways in which a visual approach to CX can transform how the support process works and how this also creates opportunities for managing fraud and identity.

As the conversation suggests: we need humans In CX so why are we restraining them by not allowing them to see what the customer can see?

https://www.linkedin.com/in/pete-jones-gryppcorp/

https://grypp.io/about-us/

Summary:

Mark Hillary and Peter Ryan discuss the evolution of visual customer experience (CX) with Pete Jones, CEO of Grypp. They highlight how visual CX, which allows agents to see customer issues in real-time, can reduce communication inefficiencies and enhance customer service. Jones shares that one in five enterprises now use visual CX, and Grypp has released 20 new innovations in the past two years. They also explore the potential of visual CX in fraud prevention and its integration with AI to improve customer interactions and operational efficiency. Jones emphasizes the importance of immediate value and the potential for significant cost savings and improved customer satisfaction.