In this conversation, Zak Stein and Marc Gafni discuss the concept of desire and its role in human existence. They explore the idea that desire is a fundamental aspect of reality and that it shapes our experience of the world. They also delve into the story of the Garden of Eden and its symbolic significance, highlighting the themes of desire, loneliness, and the search for connection. The conversation touches on the different aspects of desire, the relationship between power and desire, and the importance of understanding the interplay between devotion and desire. Overall, the conversation offers a deep exploration of desire and its implications for human life.

The conversation explores the concept of scripts of desire and how they shape our understanding of reality. The hosts discuss the story of the Garden of Eden as a script of desire and how different interpretations of the story reveal our own scripts of desire. They also delve into the idea that reality itself is a script of desire and that our participation in reality is expressed through our unique desires. The conversation highlights the importance of clarifying our desires and aligning them with the desires of reality. They also touch on the influence of advertising and the need to be conscious of the scripts of desire that are being imposed on us.

In this conversation, Marc Gafni, Ken Wilber, and Zak Stein discuss the relationship between desire and value. They explore different perspectives on desire, ranging from it being a degraded condition to it being a deed that can be controlled. They argue that desire is a condition and that clarifying desire is a way to honor its dignity. They also discuss the concept of value and its connection to prehension, emphasizing that value is both a product and a cause of prehension. They introduce the term 'Eros value' to describe the interplay between desire and value. The conversation concludes with a discussion on the need for a new language and grammar of value.

00:00 Exploring the Concept of Value

04:40 The Role of Holons and Desire

09:01 Chemistry as the Music of Desire

12:43 The Periodic Table of Desire Value

17:23 Understanding Will and Desire

23:00 The Dignity of Desire

31:26 Desire as a Condition

36:18 Value as a Product and Cause of Prehension

45:27 Introducing Eros Value

49:58 The Need for a New Language and Grammar of Value

The conversation explores the concept of scripts of desire and their role in lineage and science. The name of God is seen as the fundamental structure of reality, and in the lineage of Solomon, it is a four-letter word that means desire. The song of Solomon is a script of desire that discloses value and generates rights. In science, holons are seen as scripts of desire, and each level of wholeness represents a new value and an aspirational script of desire. The conversation also touches on the influence of scripts of desire in identity formation and the impact of advertising on shaping scripts of desire.

Chapters

00:00 Introduction

01:28 The Name of God: A Script of Desire

03:07 The Song of Solomon: A Script of Desire that Discloses Value

11:59 Holons in Science: Scripts of Desire and Wholeness

18:00 Scripts of Desire and Identity Formation

20:43 The Influence of Advertising on Scripts of Desire

25:07 Conclusion

The conversation explores the concept of value and its relationship to Eros. It delves into the distinction between Eros as a quality of being and a quality of becoming. The discussion highlights the hijacking of Eros as a feminine quality and emphasizes that Eros is both feminine and masculine. The conversation also touches on the involutionary given of value and its role in cosmic evolution. It explores the idea that value is the space in which everything arises and that desire discloses value. The ontology of story is also discussed, with the understanding that all stories are scripts of desire and value.

Chapters

00:00 Introduction and Setting the Context

02:46 Eros as a Quality of Being and Becoming

05:02 The Space of Value

08:46 The Quality of Irreducible Rightness

10:18 The Aspirational Ought

13:22 Value as an Intrinsic Ought

In this conversation, Marc and Zak discuss the nature of value and its relationship to desire. They explore the idea that value is clarified desire and that it is self-validating. They also discuss the connection between value and the name of God, as well as the role of story and pleasure in understanding value. They critique the distortion of value in contemporary culture and emphasize the importance of clarifying and reanimating our desires. They conclude by highlighting the intimate relationship between value and pleasure.

Takeaways

• Desire and need are interconnected but can be distinguished. Desire generates responsibility, while need generates rights.
• The right to attention is crucial in the technological age, as it allows individuals to exercise their other rights.
• The expansion of rights is necessary to protect human dignity and ensure equal access to fundamental aspects of human nature.
• Desire is a powerful force that should be clarified and protected, as it is essential for personal fulfillment and the well-being of society.
• The relationship between desire, rights, and responsibilities is complex and requires ongoing reflection and dialogue.

Timestamps

00:00 Introduction and Setting the Stage

01:05 The Right to Sex and Gender Conversations

04:08 First Principles and First Values0

5:07 Desire as a Fundamental Structure of Reality

06:04 The Split Between Desire and Need

07:29 The Relationship Between Desire and Value

08:58 Rights and Responsibilities

10:06 Rights and Human Nature

11:28 Expanding the List of Rights

12:56 The Right to Attention

15:13 The Relationship Between Rights and Responsibilities

15:48 The System of Rights

24:28 Protecting Attention in the Technological Age

26:05 The Need to Name New Rights

27:28 The Relationship Between Desire and Power

29:01 The Relationship Between Desire and Need

33:09 The Right to Desire and the Right to Attention

35:21 Generating Desire and Responsibility

37:00 The Poignancy of Desire

40:12 The Evolution of Desire and Need

42:52 The Needs of God

The conversation explores the importance of value and the consequences of devaluing life and meaning. It discusses the impact of deconstructing the field of value and the emergence of anti-value. The absence of value leads to a predatory and destructive mindset. The conversation emphasizes the need to recognize and engage with value in education, society, and personal development. It also highlights the connection between value and the human drive to stay alive and reproduce. The discussion concludes by emphasizing the necessity of value in creating a meaningful and welcoming universe.

Takeaways

• Value is essential and fundamental to human existence and society.
• Devaluing life and meaning leads to destructive mindsets and behaviors.
• Recognizing and engaging with value is crucial in education, society, and personal development.
• Value is connected to the human drive to stay alive and reproduce.
• Value creates a meaningful and welcoming universe.

Timestamps

00:00 Introduction: Why is value important?

07:51 The Importance of Value in Human Existence

25:37 Engaging with Value in Education and Society

30:36 The Connection Between Value and the Drive to Stay Alive

35:00 Creating a Meaningful and Welcoming Universe