Part 2: John talked with Daron Shaw, one of the nation’s best pollsters who most people have never heard of. They talked about polling, politics and the presidential election.

John talked with Daron Shaw, one of the nation’s best pollsters who most people have never heard of. They talked about polling, politics and the presidential election.

John and Joe discuss yesterday's presidental debate

John and Joe welcome Paul Vallas to the show!

Paul Vallas is best known for his innovative work in public education — as superintendent of schools in Chicago and in the all-charter school system in New Orleans — and (most recently) his impressive campaign for Mayor of Chicago (he got 48% of the vote, running against the mighty machine of the Chicago Teachers Union). Joe Klein, who has been campaigning in print against teachers unions for the better part of four decades, conducted the lion's share of the interview.

Joe and John interview Zongyuan Zoe Liu, Maurice R. Greenberg senior fellow for China studies at the Council on Foreign Relations (CFR), about her recent article in Foreign Affairs, "China's Real Economic Crisis."

Joe and John assess the Democratic National Convention, the collapse of RFK Jr.'s presidential campaign, and the rising political influence of the crypto-currency "industry."