Dr. Jordan B. Peterson speaks with psychologist and autism researcher Dr. Simon Baron-Cohen about the nature of empathy, systemizing, and the neurological basis of autism. This needed conversation explores how humans develop theory of mind, the differences between cognitive and affective empathy, and why some individuals gravitate toward systems over social interaction. They discuss the evolutionary roots of invention, gender differences in cognition, and how autistic traits relate to creativity and pattern recognition. Unflinchingly, they also discuss the darker side of empathy deficits—including psychopathy and cruelty—raising urgent questions about compassion, human development, and our capacity for evil.

Professor of Psychology and Psychiatry at the University of Cambridge, Simon Baron-Cohen is Director of the Autism Research Centre and a global leader in autism research. He pioneered the 'mindblindness' and 'empathizing-systemizing' theories, has authored over 770 scientific papers, and was knighted in 2021 for his contributions to autism understanding. His work spans clinical practice, public education, and cutting-edge research on cognitive sex differences, empathy, and neurodiversity.

This episode was filmed on July 5th, 2025

| Links |

For Simon Baron-Cohen:

On X https://x.com/sbaroncohen?lang=en

Read Dr. Baron-Cohen’s most recent book, as discussed in the show, “The Pattern Seekers: How Autism Drives Human Invention” https://a.co/d/9hsG5MR

In this deeply personal interview, Dr. Jordan B. Peterson sits down with Scott Adams, cartoonist and creator of Dilbert, to explore the unlikely paths that shape a life—from illustrating a nationally syndicated hit comic to fatal illness and facing the metaphysical. Adams shares stories of coincidence and perseverance, including how affirmations, setbacks, and sheer optimism propelled him from obscurity to national fame. The conversation dives into themes of malicious envy, systems versus goals, American culture, simulation theory, and the power of narrative perception. Both reflect on trauma, purpose, and survival—making this episode a profound meditation on how we author meaning in a truly absurd world.

This episode was filmed on July 7th, 2025

| Links |

For Scott Adams:

On X https://x.com/scottadamssays?lang=en

On Youtube, watch or listen to the “Real Coffee With Scott Adams” podcast https://www.youtube.com/@RealCoffeewithScottAdams/videos

Website https://dilbert.com/

Sparked by French’s recent New York Times article, “The Democrats’ $20 Million Man Problem,” he and Jordan Peterson discuss the societal failures contributing to male alienation—fatherlessness, loss of purpose, overmedication, and a culture that increasingly pathologizes masculinity. French shares personal insights as a father, veteran, and conservative commentator (Who is regularly published in Liberal outlets), and the two expand on themes of demoralization, the need for intentional rites of passage, and the psychological appeal of figures like Andrew Tate. The conversation closes with a stark agreement—we urgently need to reach young men with empathy, structure, and a meaningful vision for life.

This episode was filmed on July 2nd, 2025

| Links |

For David French:

On X https://x.com/davidafrench?lang=en

Read David’s work on the New York Times https://www.nytimes.com/by/david-french#latest

Read David’s most recent book, “Divided We Fall: America's Secession Threat and How to Restore Our Nation” https://a.co/d/1Ne3VBS